Forums › Final Fantasy X / X-2 HD Remaster Forum › Final Fantasy X / X-2 HD Remaster PlayStation 3 Forum › so why do people dislike this game for t ...

so why do people dislike this game for the sphere grid?

« prev next »

Page:

This topic is now read-only on GameSpot.
To post new messages, please visit GameFAQs and log in using the same email and password that you use on GameSpot.

Carlk797

Jan 26, 2013 3:33 am GMT
ElectricalBeast posted...
wolfxslash posted...
Carlk797 posted...
razmazter posted...
The only thing I dislike about the Sphere Grid in FFX is the fact that at the end of the game, if you've leveled up everyone and learned everything, then there is no more distinction. The fun that I had at the beginning of the game was switching characters in and out of battle because each character had a role to play. Towards the end of the game, however, the line that separates characters and their role blurs and everyone becomes the exact same except for their Overdrives (and Yuna's Summon abilitiy).

agreed...and that is actually the best argument I have heard. I mean does it really make any sense at all that Yuna should land 99999 hits points in physical damage. I kind of hope they do better things with the sphere grid so other attributes that make sense would be raised, or maybe you can absorb attacks like in ff7.

here's a better idea dont level Yuna Up with power spheres or Don't have her use physical then or dont have all the characters learn the same moves its optional not mandatory

makes sense i beaten the game tons of time and rarely do i have everyone one share the same moves. maybe yuna and lul.u auron and tidus, wakka does his own thing same with the rest except steal almost everyone gets that. the only way everyone needs to be like that and by everyone i mean wakka ,rikku ,and tidus the post game team. is if your going to fight all the monsters in the arena which half can be killed by just aeons. or penance (international version only) for those who may not know.

Yeah that was why I thought Penance was just stupid, the only way to truly defeat it is to max up characters in ways that make no sense, and were probably not envisioned to level up that way by the game creators. I mean beating him is really no challenge at all. I have never enjoyed secret bosses where in order to beat them you had to basically grind yourself to boredom to do it. Secret bosses are supposed to seriously challenge you but raising the limits of the enemy AI to the extreme to the point where the best you can be is challenged. It is supposed to be difficult. The Ruby and Emerald Weapons, Omega Weapon from Final Fantasy 8, that crazy C'ieth in FF 13-2 (yeah the game stank but that battle was awesome). Sephiroth in Kingdom Hearts 2 (expert mode). Those are what hidden boss battles are supposed to be like. Penance was pointless....alliteration aside.
ElectricalBeast

Jan 26, 2013 7:34 pm GMT
^yeah those are what i think secret boss fights should be challenging but you don't need to max your guy out. penance is stupid for 2 things the hyper grinding needed to beat him and the them the battle last (on average 45min)
---
continuing the legacy of the Electrical Beast all noobs should beware my teleporting powers.
pure_mind_games

Jan 26, 2013 7:50 pm GMT
From: Carlk797 | #061
Yeah that was why I thought Penance was just stupid, the only way to truly defeat it is to max up characters in ways that make no sense, and were probably not envisioned to level up that way by the game creators. I mean beating him is really no challenge at all. I have never enjoyed secret bosses where in order to beat them you had to basically grind yourself to boredom to do it. Secret bosses are supposed to seriously challenge you but raising the limits of the enemy AI to the extreme to the point where the best you can be is challenged. It is supposed to be difficult. The Ruby and Emerald Weapons, Omega Weapon from Final Fantasy 8, that crazy C'ieth in FF 13-2 (yeah the game stank but that battle was awesome). Sephiroth in Kingdom Hearts 2 (expert mode). Those are what hidden boss battles are supposed to be like. Penance was pointless....alliteration aside.

Why can't they be both? people do those NSG games for a reason, if you don't wanna level up then figure out a way to do it without levelling up.
---
Dishonored(Blind) Final Part
http://youtu.be/_A_MFwIEnWM
ElectricalBeast

Jan 27, 2013 8:25 pm GMT
pure mind games posted...
From: Carlk797 | #061
Yeah that was why I thought Penance was just stupid, the only way to truly defeat it is to max up characters in ways that make no sense, and were probably not envisioned to level up that way by the game creators. I mean beating him is really no challenge at all. I have never enjoyed secret bosses where in order to beat them you had to basically grind yourself to boredom to do it. Secret bosses are supposed to seriously challenge you but raising the limits of the enemy AI to the extreme to the point where the best you can be is challenged. It is supposed to be difficult. The Ruby and Emerald Weapons, Omega Weapon from Final Fantasy 8, that crazy C'ieth in FF 13-2 (yeah the game stank but that battle was awesome). Sephiroth in Kingdom Hearts 2 (expert mode). Those are what hidden boss battles are supposed to be like. Penance was pointless....alliteration aside.

Why can't they be both? people do those NSG games for a reason, if you don't wanna level up then figure out a way to do it without levelling up.

while thats fine its just like a nuzlock (or however you spell it) in Pokemon though i fine thats its just people trying to make the game hard which is not how the game is meant to be played. plus i have seen one of those playthoughs there not all that hard. once you've played the game enough times you know what the enemy is pretty much going to do so its all grinding for items and making good gear. though some people make even more limitations which is ridiculous. i just find trying to make the game harder really doesn't add much. its just like how bad of a situation can i put my self in.
---
continuing the legacy of the Electrical Beast all noobs should beware my teleporting powers.
ChipNoir

Jan 27, 2013 9:53 pm GMT
easymodexz posted...
I think the Sphere Grid is pretty good overall. The main issue is this:

The User Interface. There are two things that are really hard to do with the current UI:

1. See what groups of stats are located where. E.g. I want to know how much attack or defense or magic or HP a particular sphere area contains. This is impossible to track in-game, or even easily out of game.

2. Similar to #1, tracing across the full Sphere grid is tedious. I want to trace which sphere areas are linked from "heal/Yuna" area to "magic/Lulu" area, and what I need to traverse to connect them. I want to see where the intersections between Tidus/Auron/Wakka areas are. This is easier than #1, but it's still tedious in-game.

With these two things fixed, I think the Sphere Grid would be much more effective for use. The concept is great, IMO, and the mechanics are solid. It's the UI that constrains it. They need a "ZOOM OUT" function that summarizes areas and draws thick lines between sphere areas. That's really all.

That is not really the way the sphere grid works. If you unravel all it's twists and turns, it's less "Groups" and more a timeline of how much growth the 'class' line is supposed to achieve after a certain number of levels. All labeled, it would look extremely randomized.
---
The official Kefka. I hate you all.
easymodexz

Jan 28, 2013 7:48 am GMT
The timeline is broken by gates where you can hop over to a different path.

The question is how much stat tradeoff you're making going one way or another, which is not easily observable by a casual (e.g. most) player.
ElectricalBeast

Jan 28, 2013 3:55 pm GMT
easymodexz posted...
The timeline is broken by gates where you can hop over to a different path.

The question is how much stat tradeoff you're making going one way or another, which is not easily observable by a casual (e.g. most) player.

not to sure what you mean but if you mean when you hit a key sphere area that leads to a new path (a allies path). still don't know what you mean by time line are you talking about the class growth as to the story. though i finishing ones own path completely gives the stats that are beneficial to them such as tidus to auron. where they gain stats that help both of them. as to tidus going though lulus where he gains magic a not needed stat for him.

now the way where knowing the amount of stats a grid holds would be help full whould be if your trying to figure whether to do wakka or auron's grid next. which is then broken down to if you want speed and strength and accuracy or just strength. though if you don't power level you should grow at a normal rate so this shouldn't be a problem for most people.
---
continuing the legacy of the Electrical Beast all noobs should beware my teleporting powers.
easymodexz

Jan 29, 2013 12:02 pm GMT
Unless you have a different plan in mind like having Yuna pick up the Haste/Slow and Tidus switching over to Auron or Wakka for the debuffs.

Question would be related to really how much HP each of those areas have, etc. Or Evade for Rikku considering going into Lulu's. Etc.

Point being that for a casual player, one who is definitely not reading this forum, there are no decent answers to any of these questions without a frustrating degree of review, analysis, thought, research. Hence the complaints about the Sphere Grid.
ElectricalBeast

Jan 31, 2013 12:45 pm GMT
easymodexz posted...
Unless you have a different plan in mind like having Yuna pick up the Haste/Slow and Tidus switching over to Auron or Wakka for the debuffs.

Question would be related to really how much HP each of those areas have, etc. Or Evade for Rikku considering going into Lulu's. Etc.

Point being that for a casual player, one who is definitely not reading this forum, there are no decent answers to any of these questions without a frustrating degree of review, analysis, thought, research. Hence the complaints about the Sphere Grid.

not really when i frist played this game i didn't have internet nor did i play many rpgs though i could tell what the characters main stats where. knowing this i know what areas had what and when a character exiles at a certain stat their grid most likely has more of that stat than anyone else. so if i was able t figure that out when i was 11 then i think it should be common sense to most people and or kids.

saying this there really is no need to know how many stat points are in each grid. i say this because if you really don't need to now you can go down any second grid and your character will be loads better and at that point your going for skills. a function like that is for a advanced player who is trying to efficiently lvl the characters. while a casual gamer would simply go do down the path leading to a skill they want. point is for a casual gamer you don't need more to go though more than one grid. this is because they most likely won't do post game stuff.
---
continuing the legacy of the Electrical Beast all noobs should beware my teleporting powers.
Orichalon94

Feb 1, 2013 7:57 pm GMT
I liked the sphere grid. At first I didn't know why it wasn't like 7 and 9 where you had levels, but I got used to it and loved it just as much. We had both standard and expert in the UK, I used both, not sure which one I prefer, probably expert as it gives more strength to the characters.
Mx4_1204

Feb 3, 2013 2:18 am GMT
First of all, I like linearity in games. It makes it easy to understand what's next and it, at least in theory, makes for better writing since you've got one single cohesive plot. I personally find incredibly open games suffocating (say what?), but extreme linearity (ffxiii, I'm looking at you) can be just as bad, if not worse. Just letting you know me before reading what I have to say.

Secondly, I thought the sphere grid was okay. I understand what they were trying to do, defining character roles through the story, but not limiting to them if you wanted them to expand their abilities. Crystarium was the logical extreme of this idea, and I found that okay too (well, at least the first half was).

I didn't like how effing huge the sphere grid was, requiring tons upon tons of grinding (or a couple dozen tonberries) and that it took forever to get around the damn thing. I still prefer the classic level up system, but the sphere grid was an ok idea for me.
---
My MHFU Weapon Tree and Ranker --> http://www.mediafire.com/?tlkc9ymqcduas73
^^<--Sarcastrophes. They mark when I use sarcasm, which is a lot of the time
ElectricalBeast

Feb 4, 2013 12:49 am GMT
Mx4_1204 posted...
First of all, I like linearity in games. It makes it easy to understand what's next and it, at least in theory, makes for better writing since you've got one single cohesive plot. I personally find incredibly open games suffocating (say what?), but extreme linearity (ffxiii, I'm looking at you) can be just as bad, if not worse. Just letting you know me before reading what I have to say.

Secondly, I thought the sphere grid was okay. I understand what they were trying to do, defining character roles through the story, but not limiting to them if you wanted them to expand their abilities. Crystarium was the logical extreme of this idea, and I found that okay too (well, at least the first half was).

I didn't like how effing huge the sphere grid was, requiring tons upon tons of grinding (or a couple dozen tonberries) and that it took forever to get around the damn thing. I still prefer the classic level up system, but the sphere grid was an ok idea for me.

What do you mean by tons of grinding i only grinned twice my last play though maybe for a total of 2 hours ,and i was done with like 2 grids per person. That was all before the the second Seymour fight.

Also ffxiii lvl system would have been way better if they didn't try to control it so much. Making it have a forced lvl cap and the exp being horribly upgraded every level. like right now im play ffix and i can see why the ap thing didn't go over so well (have to change items way to many times)
---
continuing the legacy of the Electrical Beast all noobs should beware my teleporting powers.
Carlk797

Feb 4, 2013 8:37 pm GMT
I think what would be a good thing is maybe after you beat the game they can add the feature that is in FF7 PC where you can elevate your characters quickly of you need to. I thought it was pretty cool after I got to the end I plugged it in and was able to save so much unnecessary grinding time.
ElectricalBeast

Feb 5, 2013 12:43 am GMT
Carlk797 posted...
I think what would be a good thing is maybe after you beat the game they can add the feature that is in FF7 PC where you can elevate your characters quickly of you need to. I thought it was pretty cool after I got to the end I plugged it in and was able to save so much unnecessary grinding time.

do you mean like auto lvling them?
---
continuing the legacy of the Electrical Beast all noobs should beware my teleporting powers.
Carlk797

Feb 6, 2013 7:14 pm GMT
ElectricalBeast posted...
Carlk797 posted...
I think what would be a good thing is maybe after you beat the game they can add the feature that is in FF7 PC where you can elevate your characters quickly of you need to. I thought it was pretty cool after I got to the end I plugged it in and was able to save so much unnecessary grinding time.

do you mean like auto lvling them?

It's kind of like that...its more like a boost. Like boosting up 20 levels, of course I'm not sure how they would do that in FFX unless you just get a bunch of spheres.
ElectricalBeast

Feb 8, 2013 1:00 am GMT
i see well the sphere levels where always easy to get omega ruins will net you like a good chunk. and doing the side quest gets you a lot too. Like my one friend has a file thats 170 hours but in less then 48 hours me and him got about the same amount of stuff done. You just have to no where to level which isn't hard when you can one shoot things easily.
---
continuing the legacy of the Electrical Beast all noobs should beware my teleporting powers.
Carlk797

Feb 9, 2013 1:10 pm GMT
ElectricalBeast posted...
i see well the sphere levels where always easy to get omega ruins will net you like a good chunk. and doing the side quest gets you a lot too. Like my one friend has a file thats 170 hours but in less then 48 hours me and him got about the same amount of stuff done. You just have to no where to level which isn't hard when you can one shoot things easily.

If I grind that long I just get bored I'll be completely honest. But yes I do remember getting most of the spheres I needed there.
rpggamer29

Feb 10, 2013 9:13 am GMT
I absolutely hated it at first but I actually like it now. I hated it because you have to manually level your characters for every level which I saw as a pain. I also did not like it because if a boss was smashing you because of defense or something to that effect you couldn't just go and get three levels. You have to go and get twelve to move your defense a few points because of the sphere grid.
---
It's not paranoia if the Random Number Generator is really out to get you.
Carlk797

Feb 16, 2013 1:50 pm GMT
I think in the end they just need to tweak it where the characters don't all become the same if you grind to very high levels. I'm hoping maybe the sphere will be tweaked just a little to allow that.
ElectricalBeast

Feb 17, 2013 2:17 pm GMT
Carlk797 posted...
I think in the end they just need to tweak it where the characters don't all become the same if you grind to very high levels. I'm hoping maybe the sphere will be tweaked just a little to allow that.

its really your own fault if that happens the only way to make this change would to be to make their maxes for there stats different.
---
continuing the legacy of the Electrical Beast all noobs should beware my teleporting powers.