Sign on Options
Theme: [Light Selected] To Dark»
ForumsPrimary Games Discussion › Game franchises that betrayed their orig ...

General Games Discussion has a new name! Primary Games Discussion forum is the place to discuss all matters of the gaming world, be it the platforms, latest in industry news, or even gaming music and movies!

Rules:

- Follow the Terms of Use and read the FAQ.
- Be respectful and you'll be respected in return.
- No discussion of illegal activities.
- Cross-Platform debates belong in the System Wars forum

Game franchises that betrayed their original fanbase

Forum Actions
  • Level 62
    Stylish Crazy Action
    Posts: 6485
    User is Online
    Mar 14, 2012 11:26 am GMT

    immortality20 wrote:

    Reading this thread just makes me shake my head. Most of the games mentioned are changed for the drastic better, and prove it with sales and review scores. But hating something popular has become the "cool" thing to do this gen.

    Usually when something becomes popular it means it appeals to the lowest common denominator... There is less in a popular game that you can like specific to yourself because it's trying to please too many people. I do love a lot of popular games, but this makes sense for why a lot of people don't

    [QUOTE="immortality20"]

    Reading this thread just makes me shake my head. Most of the games mentioned are changed for the drastic better, and prove it with sales and review scores. But hating something popular has become the "cool" thing to do this gen.

    [/QUOTE]

    Usually when something becomes popular it means it appeals to the lowest common denominator... There is less in a popular game that you can like specific to yourself because it's trying to please too many people. I do love a lot of popular games, but this makes sense for why a lot of people don't

  • Level 9
    Ikari Warrior
    Posts: 43
    Mar 14, 2012 12:16 pm GMT

    Crash Bandicoot used to be my favorite game

    Crash Bandicoot used to be my favorite game :(

  • Level 63
    Big Smoke
    Posts: 81514
    Mar 14, 2012 12:57 pm GMT
    smerlus wrote:
    Did you ever play ME 1?

    Other than clunky animations, I'm not sure what didn't work about ME's combat.

    It was tactical and tense. Why does it have to be like Gears of War to be good? The only things I thought it needed, were (obviously) better animations, and a button that toggled cover. Other than that, the combat has merely been altered, not improved.

    rn|| Playing: Demon's Souls || Reading: Solid Clues ||rn|| The Atheism Union || SEN: Zeviander || last.fm ||

    [QUOTE="smerlus"]Did you ever play ME 1?[/QUOTE] Other than clunky animations, I'm not sure what didn't work about ME's combat. :? It was tactical and tense. Why does it have to be like Gears of War to be good? The only things I thought it needed, were (obviously) better animations, and a button that toggled cover. Other than that, the combat has merely been altered, not improved.
  • Level 49
    Kidd Thunder !!
    Posts: 13941
    User is Online
    Mar 14, 2012 2:33 pm GMT

    Vangaurdius wrote:
    Final Fantasy Mass Effect- Self explanatory. It went from a Space Opera that was kinda cool to Hamburger's Gay Buttsex Space Simulator Dragon Age- Could have improved upon the last one so we actually had an RPG to play since Skyrim ditched RPG for Action Adventure but noooo. Have to get at the casuals. Anything EA gets it's filthy hands on Total War- Complexity got lower and lower. Which is surprising since it was a fairly easy game as far as strategy went. Now it's just archers spam of doom. Civilization- Removed a lot of the complexity X COM- Well, I guess there is that proper one but still. The new X game- ONE MOTHER ******* SHIP?! ONE MOTHER ******* SHIP? I DON'T CARE ABOUT YOUR STUPID DRONES. What made X3 great was having a fleet of capital ships crammed with smaller ships to impose your will. Call of Duty-Went from a quality series that made you feel like you weren't a one man army, but part of a team. CoD4 was okay but felt lacking and easy, especially the MP. Command and Conquer- Now bioware is going to ruin that too. EA needs to **** off and let it rest in peace. Crysis- The open-end feel of the previous was gone along with a lot of the strategy, especially with custom missions. Battlefield- Went downhill with Bad Company. Now there's BF3 EXTREME CASUAL EDITION: LOADSA BLOOM AND LENS FLARE! REGENERATING EVERYTHING! BLOODY SCREEN! SO REAL! WUBWUBWUBWUBWUB! Ghost Recon- Went from a highly tactical shooter where stupidity would result in you getting you're **** slapped. Now it's turned into a third person Call of Duty. Far Cry- The gameplay previews say it all. Rainbow Six- Turned into Call of Duty just like Ghost Recon. No pre-mission planning where your choices could result in things going very very wrong and you lose the lives of valuable team-members Stronghold-All the 3d iterations were horrendous and buggy. 3 was just shameful. Empire Earth- The reviews say it all. Age of Empires-The FTP game. Ace Combat Turned into a movie. Sword of the Stars- The fact that they released it is just...There is no word to describe how disgusting that is. IL2-Cliffs of Dover is still a broken mess and is far more arcadey than 1946. I really wish someone would make a proper modern ww2 plane simulator. Splinter Cell- Ditched stealth for an action game with stealth tacked on. Hitman- Probably going to be just like Conviction because casuals don't have any patience. I'll add more if I think of them.

    And that's why I will never take threads like this seriously. The "fans" are just gonna keep whining no matter what the devs do.

    [QUOTE="Vangaurdius"]Final Fantasy Mass Effect- Self explanatory. It went from a Space Opera that was kinda cool to Hamburger's Gay Buttsex Space Simulator Dragon Age- Could have improved upon the last one so we actually had an RPG to play since Skyrim ditched RPG for Action Adventure but noooo. Have to get at the casuals. Anything EA gets it's filthy hands on Total War- Complexity got lower and lower. Which is surprising since it was a fairly easy game as far as strategy went. Now it's just archers spam of doom. Civilization- Removed a lot of the complexity X COM- Well, I guess there is that proper one but still. The new X game- ONE MOTHER ******* SHIP?! ONE MOTHER ******* SHIP? I DON'T CARE ABOUT YOUR STUPID DRONES. What made X3 great was having a fleet of capital ships crammed with smaller ships to impose your will. Call of Duty-Went from a quality series that made you feel like you weren't a one man army, but part of a team. CoD4 was okay but felt lacking and easy, especially the MP. Command and Conquer- Now bioware is going to ruin that too. EA needs to **** off and let it rest in peace. Crysis- The open-end feel of the previous was gone along with a lot of the strategy, especially with custom missions. Battlefield- Went downhill with Bad Company. Now there's BF3 EXTREME CASUAL EDITION: LOADSA BLOOM AND LENS FLARE! REGENERATING EVERYTHING! BLOODY SCREEN! SO REAL! WUBWUBWUBWUBWUB! Ghost Recon- Went from a highly tactical shooter where stupidity would result in you getting you're **** slapped. Now it's turned into a third person Call of Duty. Far Cry- The gameplay previews say it all. Rainbow Six- Turned into Call of Duty just like Ghost Recon. No pre-mission planning where your choices could result in things going very very wrong and you lose the lives of valuable team-members Stronghold-All the 3d iterations were horrendous and buggy. 3 was just shameful. Empire Earth- The reviews say it all. Age of Empires-The FTP game. Ace Combat Turned into a movie. Sword of the Stars- The fact that they released it is just...There is no word to describe how disgusting that is. IL2-Cliffs of Dover is still a broken mess and is far more arcadey than 1946. I really wish someone would make a proper modern ww2 plane simulator. Splinter Cell- Ditched stealth for an action game with stealth tacked on. Hitman- Probably going to be just like Conviction because casuals don't have any patience. I'll add more if I think of them.[/QUOTE]

    And that's why I will never take threads like this seriously. The "fans" are just gonna keep whining no matter what the devs do.

  • Level 43
    Sword of Sodan
    Posts: 14660
    User is Online
    Mar 14, 2012 3:39 pm GMT

    RESIDENT EVIL. Like Final Fantasy, with #7, RE4 became so popular it changed the direction of the series.

    Andross's enemy...is my enemy

    RESIDENT EVIL. Like Final Fantasy, with #7, RE4 became so popular it changed the direction of the series.

  • Level 39
    Max Force
    Posts: 671
    Mar 14, 2012 4:40 pm GMT
    nameless12345 wrote:

    Vangaurdius wrote:
    Final Fantasy Mass Effect- Self explanatory. It went from a Space Opera that was kinda cool to Hamburger's Gay Buttsex Space Simulator Dragon Age- Could have improved upon the last one so we actually had an RPG to play since Skyrim ditched RPG for Action Adventure but noooo. Have to get at the casuals. Anything EA gets it's filthy hands on Total War- Complexity got lower and lower. Which is surprising since it was a fairly easy game as far as strategy went. Now it's just archers spam of doom. Civilization- Removed a lot of the complexity X COM- Well, I guess there is that proper one but still. The new X game- ONE MOTHER ******* SHIP?! ONE MOTHER ******* SHIP? I DON'T CARE ABOUT YOUR STUPID DRONES. What made X3 great was having a fleet of capital ships crammed with smaller ships to impose your will. Call of Duty-Went from a quality series that made you feel like you weren't a one man army, but part of a team. CoD4 was okay but felt lacking and easy, especially the MP. Command and Conquer- Now bioware is going to ruin that too. EA needs to **** off and let it rest in peace. Crysis- The open-end feel of the previous was gone along with a lot of the strategy, especially with custom missions. Battlefield- Went downhill with Bad Company. Now there's BF3 EXTREME CASUAL EDITION: LOADSA BLOOM AND LENS FLARE! REGENERATING EVERYTHING! BLOODY SCREEN! SO REAL! WUBWUBWUBWUBWUB! Ghost Recon- Went from a highly tactical shooter where stupidity would result in you getting you're **** slapped. Now it's turned into a third person Call of Duty. Far Cry- The gameplay previews say it all. Rainbow Six- Turned into Call of Duty just like Ghost Recon. No pre-mission planning where your choices could result in things going very very wrong and you lose the lives of valuable team-members Stronghold-All the 3d iterations were horrendous and buggy. 3 was just shameful. Empire Earth- The reviews say it all. Age of Empires-The FTP game. Ace Combat Turned into a movie. Sword of the Stars- The fact that they released it is just...There is no word to describe how disgusting that is. IL2-Cliffs of Dover is still a broken mess and is far more arcadey than 1946. I really wish someone would make a proper modern ww2 plane simulator. Splinter Cell- Ditched stealth for an action game with stealth tacked on. Hitman- Probably going to be just like Conviction because casuals don't have any patience. I'll add more if I think of them.

    And that's why I will never take threads like this seriously. The "fans" are just gonna keep whining no matter what the devs do.



    No, the fans want the franchise to stick with the same gameplay concepts, but improve them by making them more complex and fix bugs and whatnot as technology progress. Fans don't want games casualized for simpletons.
    [QUOTE="nameless12345"]

    [QUOTE="Vangaurdius"]Final Fantasy Mass Effect- Self explanatory. It went from a Space Opera that was kinda cool to Hamburger's Gay Buttsex Space Simulator Dragon Age- Could have improved upon the last one so we actually had an RPG to play since Skyrim ditched RPG for Action Adventure but noooo. Have to get at the casuals. Anything EA gets it's filthy hands on Total War- Complexity got lower and lower. Which is surprising since it was a fairly easy game as far as strategy went. Now it's just archers spam of doom. Civilization- Removed a lot of the complexity X COM- Well, I guess there is that proper one but still. The new X game- ONE MOTHER ******* SHIP?! ONE MOTHER ******* SHIP? I DON'T CARE ABOUT YOUR STUPID DRONES. What made X3 great was having a fleet of capital ships crammed with smaller ships to impose your will. Call of Duty-Went from a quality series that made you feel like you weren't a one man army, but part of a team. CoD4 was okay but felt lacking and easy, especially the MP. Command and Conquer- Now bioware is going to ruin that too. EA needs to **** off and let it rest in peace. Crysis- The open-end feel of the previous was gone along with a lot of the strategy, especially with custom missions. Battlefield- Went downhill with Bad Company. Now there's BF3 EXTREME CASUAL EDITION: LOADSA BLOOM AND LENS FLARE! REGENERATING EVERYTHING! BLOODY SCREEN! SO REAL! WUBWUBWUBWUBWUB! Ghost Recon- Went from a highly tactical shooter where stupidity would result in you getting you're **** slapped. Now it's turned into a third person Call of Duty. Far Cry- The gameplay previews say it all. Rainbow Six- Turned into Call of Duty just like Ghost Recon. No pre-mission planning where your choices could result in things going very very wrong and you lose the lives of valuable team-members Stronghold-All the 3d iterations were horrendous and buggy. 3 was just shameful. Empire Earth- The reviews say it all. Age of Empires-The FTP game. Ace Combat Turned into a movie. Sword of the Stars- The fact that they released it is just...There is no word to describe how disgusting that is. IL2-Cliffs of Dover is still a broken mess and is far more arcadey than 1946. I really wish someone would make a proper modern ww2 plane simulator. Splinter Cell- Ditched stealth for an action game with stealth tacked on. Hitman- Probably going to be just like Conviction because casuals don't have any patience. I'll add more if I think of them.[/QUOTE]

    And that's why I will never take threads like this seriously. The "fans" are just gonna keep whining no matter what the devs do.

    [/QUOTE] No, the fans want the franchise to stick with the same gameplay concepts, but improve them by making them more complex and fix bugs and whatnot as technology progress. Fans don't want games casualized for simpletons.
  • Level 33
    Goombella
    Posts: 6300
    Mar 14, 2012 7:54 pm GMT
    I agree with you on final fantasy. Also WoW.
    I agree with you on final fantasy. Also WoW.
  • Level 7
    Sectoid
    Posts: 11
    Mar 16, 2012 8:52 am GMT

    final fantasy, after 12 the series just went down hill, in 13 and 13-2 its just boring combat and almost no exploration.

    final fantasy, after 12 the series just went down hill, in 13 and 13-2 its just boring combat and almost no exploration.

  • Level 63
    Big Smoke
    Posts: 14486
    Mar 16, 2012 10:30 am GMT
    smerlus wrote:
    dvader654 wrote:

    It was never a game for you! It was an attempt to create the first true TPS RPG, it was NEVER an RPG first. ME2 fixed the most important aspect of the franchise by far, the combat. If the combat does not work this series does not work. It needs to be a functional shooter to be the game Bioware wanted it to be. I still believe all the cuts they made in ME2 helped the flow of the game, and removed most of the useless junk that clutters RPGs. Yes the simplified the class building but the fixed the balance in ME3. Mass Effect was always a shooter, too bad if that is not what you want. There a million RPGs for you out there, there is only one game series like Mass Effect.
    Did you ever play ME 1?


    Anyways I think I know that the answer is "No." if i recall correctly. So you're pretty much unaware that Mass Effect 1 was an RPG in almost every way. You're basing your opinion off of already watered down sequels and talking out of your arse because BioWare admits they are making RPGs for the COD crowd.
    [QUOTE="smerlus"][QUOTE="dvader654"] It was never a game for you! It was an attempt to create the first true TPS RPG, it was NEVER an RPG first. ME2 fixed the most important aspect of the franchise by far, the combat. If the combat does not work this series does not work. It needs to be a functional shooter to be the game Bioware wanted it to be. I still believe all the cuts they made in ME2 helped the flow of the game, and removed most of the useless junk that clutters RPGs. Yes the simplified the class building but the fixed the balance in ME3. Mass Effect was always a shooter, too bad if that is not what you want. There a million RPGs for you out there, there is only one game series like Mass Effect.[/QUOTE] Did you ever play ME 1?[/QUOTE] Anyways I think I know that the answer is "No." if i recall correctly. So you're pretty much unaware that Mass Effect 1 was an RPG in almost every way. You're basing your opinion off of already watered down sequels and talking out of your arse because BioWare admits they are making RPGs for the COD crowd.
  • Level 20
    Metal Slime
    Posts: 4801
    Mar 16, 2012 10:42 am GMT

    Soul Calibur has become terrible.

    DBZ after Tenkaichi 3 and Budokai 3 have gone downhill

    Soul Calibur has become terrible.

    DBZ after Tenkaichi 3 and Budokai 3 have gone downhill

  • Level 70
    The Boss
    Posts: 43134
    User is Online
    Mar 16, 2012 11:38 am GMT
    smerlus wrote:
    smerlus wrote:
    dvader654 wrote:

    It was never a game for you! It was an attempt to create the first true TPS RPG, it was NEVER an RPG first. ME2 fixed the most important aspect of the franchise by far, the combat. If the combat does not work this series does not work. It needs to be a functional shooter to be the game Bioware wanted it to be. I still believe all the cuts they made in ME2 helped the flow of the game, and removed most of the useless junk that clutters RPGs. Yes the simplified the class building but the fixed the balance in ME3. Mass Effect was always a shooter, too bad if that is not what you want. There a million RPGs for you out there, there is only one game series like Mass Effect.
    Did you ever play ME 1?


    Anyways I think I know that the answer is "No." if i recall correctly. So you're pretty much unaware that Mass Effect 1 was an RPG in almost every way. You're basing your opinion off of already watered down sequels and talking out of your arse because BioWare admits they are making RPGs for the COD crowd.


    I wrote a review you can read in our review thread. Of course I played it and it was a poor RPG if that is what it was going for. It was a poor shooter as well. Yeah you had a ton of tiny boxes to raise your stats an insignificant amount like 1%, OHHH what an improvement. ME2 handled it much better making each increase be significant. I understand it removed the raising stats for weapons and choices which I feel was fine, weapons should be based on the players skill not a random dice roll. Then there was the million useless items found everywhere, a complete waste of time. If you enjoy menus ME1 is for you, sorry but I like playing a game instead.

    Bioware created the first true shoots RPG hybrid, the RPG aspects are still there just streamlined so that the focus remains on the action. What you want is the same bioware RPG over again. How dare them try a new genre!!!! Oh no cause we don't have enough of the same wrpgs. ME is one if a kind, there is no shooter with the options and story of ME, a true original.

    dvader654 Trophy Card

    THE BEST RESIDENT EVIL SITE ON THE WEB, BIOHAZE. UP TO THE SECOND NEWS ON EVERYTHING RESIDENT EVIL. http://www.biohaze.com/

    [QUOTE="smerlus"][QUOTE="smerlus"][QUOTE="dvader654"] It was never a game for you! It was an attempt to create the first true TPS RPG, it was NEVER an RPG first. ME2 fixed the most important aspect of the franchise by far, the combat. If the combat does not work this series does not work. It needs to be a functional shooter to be the game Bioware wanted it to be. I still believe all the cuts they made in ME2 helped the flow of the game, and removed most of the useless junk that clutters RPGs. Yes the simplified the class building but the fixed the balance in ME3. Mass Effect was always a shooter, too bad if that is not what you want. There a million RPGs for you out there, there is only one game series like Mass Effect.[/QUOTE] Did you ever play ME 1?[/QUOTE] Anyways I think I know that the answer is "No." if i recall correctly. So you're pretty much unaware that Mass Effect 1 was an RPG in almost every way. You're basing your opinion off of already watered down sequels and talking out of your arse because BioWare admits they are making RPGs for the COD crowd.[/QUOTE] I wrote a review you can read in our review thread. Of course I played it and it was a poor RPG if that is what it was going for. It was a poor shooter as well. Yeah you had a ton of tiny boxes to raise your stats an insignificant amount like 1%, OHHH what an improvement. ME2 handled it much better making each increase be significant. I understand it removed the raising stats for weapons and choices which I feel was fine, weapons should be based on the players skill not a random dice roll. Then there was the million useless items found everywhere, a complete waste of time. If you enjoy menus ME1 is for you, sorry but I like playing a game instead. Bioware created the first true shoots RPG hybrid, the RPG aspects are still there just streamlined so that the focus remains on the action. What you want is the same bioware RPG over again. How dare them try a new genre!!!! Oh no cause we don't have enough of the same wrpgs. ME is one if a kind, there is no shooter with the options and story of ME, a true original.
  • Level 17
    Minus World
    Posts: 54
    Mar 16, 2012 12:54 pm GMT

    Are there some games that disappointed me? Sure, but that doesn't mean they betrayed me. Until I start working on games myself, which will be never, I don't think I can be legitimately angry that a franchise didn't turn out the way I wanted. Besides, there is so much information about games before release that I always know whether I'm interested.

    Are there some games that disappointed me? Sure, but that doesn't mean they betrayed me. Until I start working on games myself, which will be never, I don't think I can be legitimately angry that a franchise didn't turn out the way I wanted. Besides, there is so much information about games before release that I always know whether I'm interested.

  • Level 39
    Max Force
    Posts: 671
    Mar 16, 2012 1:33 pm GMT
    smerlus wrote:
    smerlus wrote:
    dvader654 wrote:

    It was never a game for you! It was an attempt to create the first true TPS RPG, it was NEVER an RPG first. ME2 fixed the most important aspect of the franchise by far, the combat. If the combat does not work this series does not work. It needs to be a functional shooter to be the game Bioware wanted it to be. I still believe all the cuts they made in ME2 helped the flow of the game, and removed most of the useless junk that clutters RPGs. Yes the simplified the class building but the fixed the balance in ME3. Mass Effect was always a shooter, too bad if that is not what you want. There a million RPGs for you out there, there is only one game series like Mass Effect.
    Did you ever play ME 1?


    Anyways I think I know that the answer is "No." if i recall correctly. So you're pretty much unaware that Mass Effect 1 was an RPG in almost every way. You're basing your opinion off of already watered down sequels and talking out of your arse because BioWare admits they are making RPGs for the COD crowd.


    Mass effect was never an RPG. As I've said in the past, in order to be an RPG it has to; follow D&D rules, be almost entirely based around stats, forces you to play a with a pre-planned build, and all combat is determined by dice rolls.
    [QUOTE="smerlus"][QUOTE="smerlus"][QUOTE="dvader654"] It was never a game for you! It was an attempt to create the first true TPS RPG, it was NEVER an RPG first. ME2 fixed the most important aspect of the franchise by far, the combat. If the combat does not work this series does not work. It needs to be a functional shooter to be the game Bioware wanted it to be. I still believe all the cuts they made in ME2 helped the flow of the game, and removed most of the useless junk that clutters RPGs. Yes the simplified the class building but the fixed the balance in ME3. Mass Effect was always a shooter, too bad if that is not what you want. There a million RPGs for you out there, there is only one game series like Mass Effect.[/QUOTE] Did you ever play ME 1?[/QUOTE] Anyways I think I know that the answer is "No." if i recall correctly. So you're pretty much unaware that Mass Effect 1 was an RPG in almost every way. You're basing your opinion off of already watered down sequels and talking out of your arse because BioWare admits they are making RPGs for the COD crowd.[/QUOTE] Mass effect was never an RPG. As I've said in the past, in order to be an RPG it has to; follow D&D rules, be almost entirely based around stats, forces you to play a with a pre-planned build, and all combat is determined by dice rolls.
  • Level 35
    Stitches
    Posts: 983
    Mar 16, 2012 1:40 pm GMT

    any video game franchise that became popular has done this.

    Then come with me, you can never go back to being apart of that "everyone". One day you will run headlong into the same despair that i did.
    sinanju

    any video game franchise that became popular has done this.

  • Level 63
    Big Smoke
    Posts: 14486
    Mar 16, 2012 6:23 pm GMT
    dvader654 wrote:
    I wrote a review you can read in our review thread. Of course I played it and it was a poor RPG if that is what it was going for. It was a poor shooter as well. Yeah you had a ton of tiny boxes to raise your stats an insignificant amount like 1%, OHHH what an improvement. ME2 handled it much better making each increase be significant. I understand it removed the raising stats for weapons and choices which I feel was fine, weapons should be based on the players skill not a random dice roll. Then there was the million useless items found everywhere, a complete waste of time. If you enjoy menus ME1 is for you, sorry but I like playing a game instead. Bioware created the first true shoots RPG hybrid, the RPG aspects are still there just streamlined so that the focus remains on the action. What you want is the same bioware RPG over again. How dare them try a new genre!!!! Oh no cause we don't have enough of the same wrpgs. ME is one if a kind, there is no shooter with the options and story of ME, a true original.


    Ok so you have played it so you should realize that when you said they didn't make a game for RPG players you were wrong. It's not like BioWare accidentally created the first ME as an RPG. Second its an action RPG and it is specifically created for people that want instant gratification....once again it's what BioWare stated they intended to do and they did that. That's what makes it a poor RPG.
    [QUOTE="dvader654"] I wrote a review you can read in our review thread. Of course I played it and it was a poor RPG if that is what it was going for. It was a poor shooter as well. Yeah you had a ton of tiny boxes to raise your stats an insignificant amount like 1%, OHHH what an improvement. ME2 handled it much better making each increase be significant. I understand it removed the raising stats for weapons and choices which I feel was fine, weapons should be based on the players skill not a random dice roll. Then there was the million useless items found everywhere, a complete waste of time. If you enjoy menus ME1 is for you, sorry but I like playing a game instead. Bioware created the first true shoots RPG hybrid, the RPG aspects are still there just streamlined so that the focus remains on the action. What you want is the same bioware RPG over again. How dare them try a new genre!!!! Oh no cause we don't have enough of the same wrpgs. ME is one if a kind, there is no shooter with the options and story of ME, a true original. [/QUOTE] Ok so you have played it so you should realize that when you said they didn't make a game for RPG players you were wrong. It's not like BioWare accidentally created the first ME as an RPG. Second its an action RPG and it is specifically created for people that want instant gratification....once again it's what BioWare stated they intended to do and they did that. That's what makes it a poor RPG.
  • Level 38
    DJ Boy
    Posts: 8333
    User is Online
    Mar 16, 2012 6:30 pm GMT
    Smokescreened84 wrote:
    Mirror's Edge may be going the unwanted route, form the trailer i saw a couple of hours ago for the sequel. Male lead only - Faith's son since Faith has been kidnapped - and most likely turned into yet another shooter.
    Guess it was too much to ask for for EA to not interfere with that game.


    Wait, what!? Links?
    [QUOTE="Smokescreened84"]Mirror's Edge may be going the unwanted route, form the trailer i saw a couple of hours ago for the sequel. Male lead only - Faith's son since Faith has been kidnapped - and most likely turned into yet another shooter. Guess it was too much to ask for for EA to not interfere with that game.[/QUOTE] Wait, what!? Links?
  • Level 70
    The Boss
    Posts: 43134
    User is Online
    Mar 16, 2012 6:54 pm GMT

    smerlus wrote:
    dvader654 wrote:
    I wrote a review you can read in our review thread. Of course I played it and it was a poor RPG if that is what it was going for. It was a poor shooter as well. Yeah you had a ton of tiny boxes to raise your stats an insignificant amount like 1%, OHHH what an improvement. ME2 handled it much better making each increase be significant. I understand it removed the raising stats for weapons and choices which I feel was fine, weapons should be based on the players skill not a random dice roll. Then there was the million useless items found everywhere, a complete waste of time. If you enjoy menus ME1 is for you, sorry but I like playing a game instead. Bioware created the first true shoots RPG hybrid, the RPG aspects are still there just streamlined so that the focus remains on the action. What you want is the same bioware RPG over again. How dare them try a new genre!!!! Oh no cause we don't have enough of the same wrpgs. ME is one if a kind, there is no shooter with the options and story of ME, a true original.
    Ok so you have played it so you should realize that when you said they didn't make a game for RPG players you were wrong. It's not like BioWare accidentally created the first ME as an RPG. Second its an action RPG and it is specifically created for people that want instant gratification....once again it's what BioWare stated they intended to do and they did that. That's what makes it a poor RPG.

    They made a game that was lost between two genres, it did not do either very well. They found what they should focus on in ME2. What makes you think ME1 was a better RPG than it was a shooter? It had more choices but those choices were implemented into a poor combat system which to me makes those choices irrelevant. If the entire goal of moving around stats is to better your combat, then why do you want the combat to remain crappy. Basically you are saying you are in favor of more menus, less action, its crazy. They fixed the problem in ME2. All the RPG elements that mattered like the story, choices, classes, leveling all remain. They filtered out what was not needed.

    And what is this instant gratification bullcrap I keep hearing from you guys. What sitting in a menu distributing points instantly makes the game more "hardcore". You feel better cause you put 1% more into weapon power than armor. Its all smoke and mirrors in a game like this. In a true RPG where your skills as a player doesn't matter sure your stat choices matter. In a game where you are in control, where your skill is the most important aspect all that matters is that your health increases, you have the powers distributed the way you want them and your weapon selection fits the situation. Thankfully Bioware focused on those things. ME1 is no different from ME2, its just a cluttered mess with too many options where they didnt need to be.

    Bioware wanted to make an action RPG from the start, to make an action RPG you need quality action. It is as simply as that. They failed in some ways with ME1 and I guess that gave RPG fans hope that they wouldn't make it an action RPG.

    Edited on Mar 16, 2012 7:02 pm GMT Edited 3 total times.

    dvader654 Trophy Card

    THE BEST RESIDENT EVIL SITE ON THE WEB, BIOHAZE. UP TO THE SECOND NEWS ON EVERYTHING RESIDENT EVIL. http://www.biohaze.com/

    [QUOTE="smerlus"][QUOTE="dvader654"] I wrote a review you can read in our review thread. Of course I played it and it was a poor RPG if that is what it was going for. It was a poor shooter as well. Yeah you had a ton of tiny boxes to raise your stats an insignificant amount like 1%, OHHH what an improvement. ME2 handled it much better making each increase be significant. I understand it removed the raising stats for weapons and choices which I feel was fine, weapons should be based on the players skill not a random dice roll. Then there was the million useless items found everywhere, a complete waste of time. If you enjoy menus ME1 is for you, sorry but I like playing a game instead. Bioware created the first true shoots RPG hybrid, the RPG aspects are still there just streamlined so that the focus remains on the action. What you want is the same bioware RPG over again. How dare them try a new genre!!!! Oh no cause we don't have enough of the same wrpgs. ME is one if a kind, there is no shooter with the options and story of ME, a true original. [/QUOTE] Ok so you have played it so you should realize that when you said they didn't make a game for RPG players you were wrong. It's not like BioWare accidentally created the first ME as an RPG. Second its an action RPG and it is specifically created for people that want instant gratification....once again it's what BioWare stated they intended to do and they did that. That's what makes it a poor RPG. [/QUOTE]

    They made a game that was lost between two genres, it did not do either very well. They found what they should focus on in ME2. What makes you think ME1 was a better RPG than it was a shooter? It had more choices but those choices were implemented into a poor combat system which to me makes those choices irrelevant. If the entire goal of moving around stats is to better your combat, then why do you want the combat to remain crappy. Basically you are saying you are in favor of more menus, less action, its crazy. They fixed the problem in ME2. All the RPG elements that mattered like the story, choices, classes, leveling all remain. They filtered out what was not needed.

    And what is this instant gratification bullcrap I keep hearing from you guys. What sitting in a menu distributing points instantly makes the game more "hardcore". You feel better cause you put 1% more into weapon power than armor. Its all smoke and mirrors in a game like this. In a true RPG where your skills as a player doesn't matter sure your stat choices matter. In a game where you are in control, where your skill is the most important aspect all that matters is that your health increases, you have the powers distributed the way you want them and your weapon selection fits the situation. Thankfully Bioware focused on those things. ME1 is no different from ME2, its just a cluttered mess with too many options where they didnt need to be.

    Bioware wanted to make an action RPG from the start, to make an action RPG you need quality action. It is as simply as that. They failed in some ways with ME1 and I guess that gave RPG fans hope that they wouldn't make it an action RPG.

  • Level 31
    Ippon!
    Posts: 2147
    Mar 16, 2012 7:30 pm GMT

    2 definite disappointements that come to mind are GTA4 and the lackluster, interactive movie called Uncharted 3.

    Edited on Mar 16, 2012 7:31 pm GMT

    I want a Wafflebot!

    2 definite disappointements that come to mind are GTA4 and the lackluster, interactive movie called Uncharted 3.

  • Level 63
    Big Smoke
    Posts: 14486
    Mar 17, 2012 11:11 am GMT
    dvader654 wrote:

    They made a game that was lost between two genres, it did not do either very well. They found what they should focus on in ME2. What makes you think ME1 was a better RPG than it was a shooter? It had more choices but those choices were implemented into a poor combat system which to me makes those choices irrelevant. If the entire goal of moving around stats is to better your combat, then why do you want the combat to remain crappy. Basically you are saying you are in favor of more menus, less action, its crazy. They fixed the problem in ME2. All the RPG elements that mattered like the story, choices, classes, leveling all remain. They filtered out what was not needed.


    And what is this instant gratification bullcrap I keep hearing from you guys. What sitting in a menu distributing points instantly makes the game more "hardcore". You feel better cause you put 1% more into weapon power than armor. Its all smoke and mirrors in a game like this. In a true RPG where your skills as a player doesn't matter sure your stat choices matter. In a game where you are in control, where your skill is the most important aspect all that matters is that your health increases, you have the powers distributed the way you want them and your weapon selection fits the situation. Thankfully Bioware focused on those things. ME1 is no different from ME2, its just a cluttered mess with too many options where they didnt need to be.


    Bioware wanted to make an action RPG from the start, to make an action RPG you need quality action. It is as simply as that. They failed in some ways with ME1 and I guess that gave RPG fans hope that they wouldn't make it an action RPG.



    You do realize you proved my point in the second paragraph right? First you wanted to call the "Instant Gratification" line BS then you said;

    1: You don't want to spend time in menus.
    2: You don't want small increases in power.
    3. More Action.

    Did you ever stop to think that another reason the shooting improved from ME 1 to 2 is that they were more comfortable with the engine seeing as ME1 was their first attempt at a third person shooter? How would them removing weapons and armor code magically make the shooting code or AI improve from ME1 to ME2?

    Hence this game ending up on a bunch of people's list of "Game franchises that betrayed their fan base."
    [QUOTE="dvader654"]

    They made a game that was lost between two genres, it did not do either very well. They found what they should focus on in ME2. What makes you think ME1 was a better RPG than it was a shooter? It had more choices but those choices were implemented into a poor combat system which to me makes those choices irrelevant. If the entire goal of moving around stats is to better your combat, then why do you want the combat to remain crappy. Basically you are saying you are in favor of more menus, less action, its crazy. They fixed the problem in ME2. All the RPG elements that mattered like the story, choices, classes, leveling all remain. They filtered out what was not needed.

    And what is this instant gratification bullcrap I keep hearing from you guys. What sitting in a menu distributing points instantly makes the game more "hardcore". You feel better cause you put 1% more into weapon power than armor. Its all smoke and mirrors in a game like this. In a true RPG where your skills as a player doesn't matter sure your stat choices matter. In a game where you are in control, where your skill is the most important aspect all that matters is that your health increases, you have the powers distributed the way you want them and your weapon selection fits the situation. Thankfully Bioware focused on those things. ME1 is no different from ME2, its just a cluttered mess with too many options where they didnt need to be.

    Bioware wanted to make an action RPG from the start, to make an action RPG you need quality action. It is as simply as that. They failed in some ways with ME1 and I guess that gave RPG fans hope that they wouldn't make it an action RPG.

    [/QUOTE] You do realize you proved my point in the second paragraph right? First you wanted to call the "Instant Gratification" line BS then you said; 1: You don't want to spend time in menus. 2: You don't want small increases in power. 3. More Action. Did you ever stop to think that another reason the shooting improved from ME 1 to 2 is that they were more comfortable with the engine seeing as ME1 was their first attempt at a third person shooter? How would them removing weapons and armor code magically make the shooting code or AI improve from ME1 to ME2? Hence this game ending up on a bunch of people's list of "Game franchises that betrayed their fan base."
  • Level 70
    The Boss
    Posts: 43134
    User is Online
    Mar 17, 2012 2:04 pm GMT
    smerlus wrote:
    dvader654 wrote:

    They made a game that was lost between two genres, it did not do either very well. They found what they should focus on in ME2. What makes you think ME1 was a better RPG than it was a shooter? It had more choices but those choices were implemented into a poor combat system which to me makes those choices irrelevant. If the entire goal of moving around stats is to better your combat, then why do you want the combat to remain crappy. Basically you are saying you are in favor of more menus, less action, its crazy. They fixed the problem in ME2. All the RPG elements that mattered like the story, choices, classes, leveling all remain. They filtered out what was not needed.


    And what is this instant gratification bullcrap I keep hearing from you guys. What sitting in a menu distributing points instantly makes the game more "hardcore". You feel better cause you put 1% more into weapon power than armor. Its all smoke and mirrors in a game like this. In a true RPG where your skills as a player doesn't matter sure your stat choices matter. In a game where you are in control, where your skill is the most important aspect all that matters is that your health increases, you have the powers distributed the way you want them and your weapon selection fits the situation. Thankfully Bioware focused on those things. ME1 is no different from ME2, its just a cluttered mess with too many options where they didnt need to be.


    Bioware wanted to make an action RPG from the start, to make an action RPG you need quality action. It is as simply as that. They failed in some ways with ME1 and I guess that gave RPG fans hope that they wouldn't make it an action RPG.



    You do realize you proved my point in the second paragraph right? First you wanted to call the "Instant Gratification" line BS then you said;

    1: You don't want to spend time in menus.
    2: You don't want small increases in power.
    3. More Action.

    Did you ever stop to think that another reason the shooting improved from ME 1 to 2 is that they were more comfortable with the engine seeing as ME1 was their first attempt at a third person shooter? How would them removing weapons and armor code magically make the shooting code or AI improve from ME1 to ME2?

    Hence this game ending up on a bunch of people's list of "Game franchises that betrayed their fan base."


    I feel like streamling the aspects of the combat that work and removing the clutter, the excess useless items and aspects that bog down the game is beneficial to a shooter. It takes you out of the game if you are spending to much time in menus. I am saying spending time in menus in a game like this is pointless, you are not playing a better game if you get to distribute every single percentage point when in the end it is your skills as a shooter that ultimately makes the gameplay work. It is not instant gratification, its solid gameplay.

    And what makes the RPG fan the original fanbase. Say they went the other way, they went all RPG and removed the shooter aspects, wouldn't the shooter fans be just as betrayed? Whether you want to admit it or not they accomplished the hybrid, it is an RPG and it is a shooter. ME1 did not do it well, it was clunky, the combat had issues and it lacked a serious direction. ME3 got the balance the best so it did take three games to master it but they did it. It still has a ton of RPG elements and it is a fantastic shooter.

    dvader654 Trophy Card

    THE BEST RESIDENT EVIL SITE ON THE WEB, BIOHAZE. UP TO THE SECOND NEWS ON EVERYTHING RESIDENT EVIL. http://www.biohaze.com/

    [QUOTE="smerlus"][QUOTE="dvader654"]

    They made a game that was lost between two genres, it did not do either very well. They found what they should focus on in ME2. What makes you think ME1 was a better RPG than it was a shooter? It had more choices but those choices were implemented into a poor combat system which to me makes those choices irrelevant. If the entire goal of moving around stats is to better your combat, then why do you want the combat to remain crappy. Basically you are saying you are in favor of more menus, less action, its crazy. They fixed the problem in ME2. All the RPG elements that mattered like the story, choices, classes, leveling all remain. They filtered out what was not needed.

    And what is this instant gratification bullcrap I keep hearing from you guys. What sitting in a menu distributing points instantly makes the game more "hardcore". You feel better cause you put 1% more into weapon power than armor. Its all smoke and mirrors in a game like this. In a true RPG where your skills as a player doesn't matter sure your stat choices matter. In a game where you are in control, where your skill is the most important aspect all that matters is that your health increases, you have the powers distributed the way you want them and your weapon selection fits the situation. Thankfully Bioware focused on those things. ME1 is no different from ME2, its just a cluttered mess with too many options where they didnt need to be.

    Bioware wanted to make an action RPG from the start, to make an action RPG you need quality action. It is as simply as that. They failed in some ways with ME1 and I guess that gave RPG fans hope that they wouldn't make it an action RPG.

    [/QUOTE] You do realize you proved my point in the second paragraph right? First you wanted to call the "Instant Gratification" line BS then you said; 1: You don't want to spend time in menus. 2: You don't want small increases in power. 3. More Action. Did you ever stop to think that another reason the shooting improved from ME 1 to 2 is that they were more comfortable with the engine seeing as ME1 was their first attempt at a third person shooter? How would them removing weapons and armor code magically make the shooting code or AI improve from ME1 to ME2? Hence this game ending up on a bunch of people's list of "Game franchises that betrayed their fan base."[/QUOTE] I feel like streamling the aspects of the combat that work and removing the clutter, the excess useless items and aspects that bog down the game is beneficial to a shooter. It takes you out of the game if you are spending to much time in menus. I am saying spending time in menus in a game like this is pointless, you are not playing a better game if you get to distribute every single percentage point when in the end it is your skills as a shooter that ultimately makes the gameplay work. It is not instant gratification, its solid gameplay. And what makes the RPG fan the original fanbase. Say they went the other way, they went all RPG and removed the shooter aspects, wouldn't the shooter fans be just as betrayed? Whether you want to admit it or not they accomplished the hybrid, it is an RPG and it is a shooter. ME1 did not do it well, it was clunky, the combat had issues and it lacked a serious direction. ME3 got the balance the best so it did take three games to master it but they did it. It still has a ton of RPG elements and it is a fantastic shooter.
Forum Actions
ForumsPrimary Games Discussion › Game franchises that betrayed their orig ...