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A VERY simple way to make NSMB2 much better (and SM3DL for that matter)

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  • Jun 8, 2012 5:36 pm GMT
    Two modes - normal, hard.

    Hard mode...

    1. 500 coins = 1up (I'm not sure if this game has 1ups that way, but anyway)

    2. Can't go backwards in a level (like they did in NSMB)

    3. If you're powered up with a Fire Flower or Raccoon Tail, getting hit brings you all the way to being small (ala Lost Levels).

    4. Make Luigi much more slippery (this could be done but it wouldn't make too much sense since there's co-op.)

    5. Decreased time to complete a level. Still enough that you don't have to speed run it, but you can't dawdle.

    I'm sure barely one of these will make it into the game, but it doesn't hurt to wonder. The programming and thought to implement these are minimal, but they can significantly up the challenge.

    Why can't developers put harder difficulties in everything? *sigh*
    ---
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  • Jun 8, 2012 5:39 pm GMT
    Marsford posted...
    Why can't developers put harder difficulties in everything? *sigh*
    ---


    great idea especially 3, 4, and 5.
    To answer what I quoted Miyamoto.
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  • Jun 8, 2012 6:36 pm GMT
    i'd be all for it if they had a truly easy mode,no unlockables tied to hard levels OR assist blocks still appear in harder levels(seriously what since does it make to put them in the easy levels but not the hard levels maybe the ammount times you have to die is higher in hard mode or something but it should be in either hard mode and easy)

    and please don't troll me sayng mario games are easy enough. the easy mode WOULD BE OPTIONAL OPTIONAL is some much to ask that default difficulty be easy and harder modes can be hard but never the default mode?
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  • Jun 8, 2012 6:40 pm GMT
    SMASHKING84 posted...
    i'd be all for it if they had a truly easy mode,no unlockables tied to hard levels OR assist blocks still appear in harder levels(seriously what since does it make to put them in the easy levels but not the hard levels maybe the ammount times you have to die is higher in hard mode or something but it should be in either hard mode and easy)

    and please don't troll me sayng mario games are easy enough. the easy mode WOULD BE OPTIONAL OPTIONAL is some much to ask that default difficulty be easy and harder modes can be hard but never the default mode?


    Well for SM3DL the default difficulty (i.e. the first 8 worlds) were easy enough.

    I thought NSMB was okay. Not too hard, but still a respectable amount of timing needed. Especially with Mini Mario runs =)
    ---
    Official Warrior General of the KDF.
    Data is trolling.
  • Jun 8, 2012 6:40 pm GMT
    Marsford posted...
    Two modes - normal, hard.

    Hard mode...

    1. 500 coins = 1up (I'm not sure if this game has 1ups that way, but anyway)

    2. Can't go backwards in a level (like they did in NSMB)

    3. If you're powered up with a Fire Flower or Raccoon Tail, getting hit brings you all the way to being small (ala Lost Levels).

    4. Make Luigi much more slippery (this could be done but it wouldn't make too much sense since there's co-op.)

    5. Decreased time to complete a level. Still enough that you don't have to speed run it, but you can't dawdle.

    I'm sure barely one of these will make it into the game, but it doesn't hurt to wonder. The programming and thought to implement these are minimal, but they can significantly up the challenge.

    Why can't developers put harder difficulties in everything? *sigh*
    ---


    1. Sure

    2. No. Its a old outdated and useless mechanic that unlike 1ups holds no nostalgia or charm.

    3. I guess

    4. Would unfairly disadvantage the second player and be kinda stupid I want to lose because of tough platforming not luigi being a clumsy ass! Sure he is more slippery in galaxy but those don't require nearly as much precise platforming and the spin can save you. Wouldn't work well for a 2D game at all.

    5. No

    How about we just make it as hard as NSMBW(Harder then NSMB) and then a decent length post game that brings levels that are more challenging and approaching super meat boy difficulty level near the end?

    Honestly your idea seems like adding a bunch of archaic limitations and stupid crap. Difficulty in platformers should be tough levels.. Time limits are for speed runs and special challenges not forcing you to blast through levels at top speed even in more relaxed levels!
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  • Jun 8, 2012 6:44 pm GMT
    None of that makes the game any harder.

    Well, it adds fake difficulty, which is never a good thing.

    Lost Levels is a serious offender when it comes to fake difficulty.

    I'd prefer real difficulty.
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    Swagodile's alt.
  • Jun 8, 2012 6:45 pm GMT
    Hard mode sounds good.

    Indifferent toward 500 = one-ups. Lives have been meaningless since Super Mario 64 ( at least Super Mario World had save points. )

    Don't like the idea of not being able to go back for something I missed.

    Third idea seems fine.

    Making Luigi more slippery seems fine. That's how he's meant to be anyway. I kind of want him to stick with his flutter jump if you hold the button. As for making the characters different, I don't see the problem. They did it for Diddy Kong in DKCR.

    Don't really like time limits in general, I like to take my time on some levels. Take in the sights, mess around.
    ---
    Complaints have a purpose. One voice becomes one hundred becomes one thousand. Enough common complaints among a crowd is sure to reach it's intended target.
  • Jun 8, 2012 6:46 pm GMT
    Catcher_Freeman posted...
    I'd prefer real difficulty.


    So you want this?
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=in6RZzdGki8
    ---
    Is it wrong to have a fangirl crush on Chun Li?
  • Jun 8, 2012 6:48 pm GMT
    From: MrHayes77 | #008
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=in6RZzdGki8

    That's not real difficulty, and I don't see what a ROM hack has to do with my argument.
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    Swagodile's alt.
  • Jun 8, 2012 6:57 pm GMT
    pikachupwnage posted...
    How about we just make it as hard as NSMBW(Harder then NSMB) and then a decent length post game that brings levels that are more challenging and approaching super meat boy difficulty level near the end?

    Honestly your idea seems like adding a bunch of archaic limitations and stupid crap. Difficulty in platformers should be tough levels.. Time limits are for speed runs and special challenges not forcing you to blast through levels at top speed even in more relaxed levels!


    You're saying archaic like it's a buzzword. You are not going to have difficulty through level design in Mario platformers anymore. Casualization a la max. Don't even get me started on NSMBW - that wasn't that hard either.

    Nintendo is trying to grab anyone and everyone with these games. Why would they alienate a whole cavalcade of potential casual gamers with frustrating difficulty?

    And this would be OPTIONAL and probably unlockable. So you guys wouldn't have to worry about not being able to go back, because you already did in the first run of the game.
    ---
    Official Warrior General of the KDF.
    Data is trolling.
  • Jun 8, 2012 6:58 pm GMT
    Catcher_Freeman posted...
    I'd prefer real difficulty.


    It's not going to happen. My ideas at least bring some challenge to a series that will never be challenging (relatively).
    ---
    Official Warrior General of the KDF.
    Data is trolling.
  • Jun 8, 2012 7:03 pm GMT
    honestly ill admit in sm3dland i didn't have any trouble until world 8 but come on world 8 was pretty tough.
    Im comparing this to the final level in any mario game. smb 1 8-4 is only hard if you don't have a fire flower imo 8-1 is much thougher(8-4 was more of a puzzle level)
    smb 2us ok 7-2 is pretty tough but wart was a push over
    lost levels i never got past 2-3 so i'll just n/a

    smb3 world 8 is kinda wierd first level is hard next level is easy and it keeps switching but the final airship level was much harder then the final castle (which is only hard without racoon mario)
    smw ok this is hard if yo played the original version but the gba version is easier then smb3 imo

    sm64 i would say this level was one of the few final levels that was tougher then the rest of the game.
    sunshine for some reason the last level is much much easier then 90% of the game(imo)
    nsmb ds a few castle were hard but again the final level is not hardest level in the game
    galaxy idk maybe if they didn't put starbits and 1ups near the checkpoint but yes the actual level it's self is harder then most of the game there are thougher galaxies but most of them are easily skipable if you only want 60 stars.

    nsmb wii n/a never finished the game
    galaxy2 see above
    then 3dland ok the actual level it's self isn't too bad it's more you're fighting a 3 phase boss fight at the end(each phase is harder then the last as well...)
    i don't measure difficulty by gameovers cause let's face it even in lost levels if use the 1up trick you won't ever see a gameover.

    I do go by death count you know what i consider a fair death count in one level? 10 death anymore then that i consider the level too much(because except for lost levels i never died more then 10 times in a level until that is i played 3dland) so yeah if the common demonator is 1-9 lives lost in every mario game but 2 then ether those other games are really easy(i wouldn't say about anything but nsmbds) or the two games that stand out are hard.
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    Twilight Princess is the best zelda hands down people who agree:41

    www.youtube.com/watch?v=bzUNg1Uqy_Y

  • Jun 8, 2012 7:17 pm GMT
    World and SMB3 were the perfect amount of challenge IMO.

    Yeah the extra worlds for 3D Land were pretty damn challenging. Well a few of them anyway. I think one of them I got like 30 or so deaths. The special worlds were essentially the hard mode of the regular worlds, which I thought was a fantastic idea. If NSMB2 does this I would be exponentially more happy than my simple ideas....but I'm skeptical that it would happen.
    ---
    Official Warrior General of the KDF.
    Data is trolling.
  • Jun 8, 2012 7:54 pm GMT
    Ok honestly what exactly causes people to think smb3,and world are harder then other mario games ok maybe nsmb ds


    seriously i swear you guys are probally going by how hard you remember smb3 was as a kid because if you still play it today you notice t's just not that hard maybe the fact that sm3dland is new game is why i can't get used to the difficulty but the fact remains i can beat both smw and smb3 with little effort and this game took me a lot more...
    ---
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    Twilight Princess is the best zelda hands down people who agree:41

    www.youtube.com/watch?v=bzUNg1Uqy_Y

  • Jun 8, 2012 8:00 pm GMT
    SMASHKING84 posted...
    Ok honestly what exactly causes people to think smb3,and world are harder then other mario games ok maybe nsmb ds


    seriously i swear you guys are probally going by how hard you remember smb3 was as a kid because if you still play it today you notice t's just not that hard maybe the fact that sm3dland is new game is why i can't get used to the difficulty but the fact remains i can beat both smw and smb3 with little effort and this game took me a lot more...


    World 7 and 8 were pretty tricky for SMB3. The game also generally moved faster and was a bit slipperier, not to mention objectively more hazards.
    ---
    Official Warrior General of the KDF.
    Data is trolling.
  • Jun 8, 2012 8:39 pm GMT
    SMASHKING84 posted...
    Ok honestly what exactly causes people to think smb3,and world are harder then other mario games ok maybe nsmb ds


    seriously i swear you guys are probally going by how hard you remember smb3 was as a kid because if you still play it today you notice t's just not that hard maybe the fact that sm3dland is new game is why i can't get used to the difficulty but the fact remains i can beat both smw and smb3 with little effort and this game took me a lot more...


    This.

    Anyway, the ideas are okay, but rather than being gimped, and making it so that the world goes out of its way to go against you, why not just have tricky platforming? 9-7, NSMBW and that one...horrid...sinister variation of that beat block level in SM3DL are examples of clever and tricky platforming.
  • Jun 8, 2012 10:58 pm GMT
    I feel like people focus too much on challenge in Mario games rather than what actually makes the games good.
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    Mariowned.
  • Jun 9, 2012 7:47 am GMT
    Here was an idea I liked, DKCR had you collecting the KONG letters and if you got all of them in a world, then you unlocked the difficult temple level for that world. So you get a handful of easy levels, play circles around them and then the game throws you a challenge to try if you want. It would at least throw something at players who don't want to play for hours before they find something they find that is their level.

    Also I am hoping that with the gold coins gimmick Mario can show off some stronger level design since it will encourage exploration for more coins. Experienced players will find those pockets of coins filled with tougher challenges while more casual players who just want to get to the end will have an easier path with far less coins.
  • Jun 9, 2012 8:00 am GMT
    MarioMan847 posted...
    I feel like people focus too much on challenge in Mario games rather than what actually makes the games good.


    This personally think while smb3 and galaxy 1 were easier the some games they hit the mark perfectly they were challenging but never on masochistic levels imo (unlike some game *sigh*)
    ---
    The Official Jester of The NDFi1098.photobucket.com/albums/g380/TravyCD/TrayCD%20Album%205 /TravyCD%20Album6/Smash4Roster.jpg

    Twilight Princess is the best zelda hands down people who agree:41

    www.youtube.com/watch?v=bzUNg1Uqy_Y

  • Jun 9, 2012 4:40 pm GMT
    Marsford posted...
    Two modes - normal, hard.

    Hard mode...

    1. 500 coins = 1up (I'm not sure if this game has 1ups that way, but anyway)

    2. Can't go backwards in a level (like they did in NSMB)

    3. If you're powered up with a Fire Flower or Raccoon Tail, getting hit brings you all the way to being small (ala Lost Levels).

    4. Make Luigi much more slippery (this could be done but it wouldn't make too much sense since there's co-op.)

    5. Decreased time to complete a level. Still enough that you don't have to speed run it, but you can't dawdle.

    I'm sure barely one of these will make it into the game, but it doesn't hurt to wonder. The programming and thought to implement these are minimal, but they can significantly up the challenge.

    ---


    1. Maybe.
    2. I suppose I can live with that
    3. No. It makes sense that if you gain 2 power ups, it should take 3 hits to die.
    4. No.
    5. maybe.

    Plus, I don't think that any NSMB had the option to skip most of the levels.
    ---
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